Jodi Arias Trial : Day 14 : Behind Bedroom Doors (No Sidebars)

Jodi Arias Trial : Day 14 : Behind Bedroom Doors (No Sidebars) - Çift Dilli Altyazılar

You Please stand for the jury.

Please be seated.

The will show the presence of the jury, the defendant, and counsel.

This area is sure still under oath to understand.

Yes, it is.

May I continue?

Thank you, Your Honor.

Good morning, Ms.

Harris.

Good morning.

Yesterday when we finished,

we were talking, we were at a point in your life when you were about ready to move in with Matt McCartney, do you recall?

Yes.

That's we left off.

Okay.

And yesterday I'd ask you, if at this point in time, you were boyfriend and girlfriend.

And it seemed like you didn't have a definitive answer for that.

Is that a label you two didn't use or?

I don't recall when we made things official, but he wasn't seeing anyone else in either.

Was I?

I'm sorry.

What was that?

I don't recall when we made it official, our relationship.

I it definitely became that way.

I don't remember the exact date or time or circumstance, but we weren't seeing anybody else just each other.

Okay.

So you moved in together, it was with the idea that this was a monogamous relationship.

Yes.

Okay.

And you were working, I believe you told us you got a job at Applebee's, right?

Yes.

Okay.

And was Matt working?

Yes, he was a manager at Subway.

Okay.

Tell us what life was like and how was the relationship.

How he treat you?

I see that period of my life is probably one of the best times in my life.

He treated me very well.

He was very kind.

He was very respectful.

He was very spiritual.

When I first met him, I was a little bit larry of some of the things he was into.

I saw some books on witchcraft and I thought that he explained to me that he was just seeking that he had gone to

church most of his life.

And He and his family are very much into the Native American culture and so he asked his pastor

about the Native Americans and he was told they went to hell because they didn't know Jesus Christ.

So that turned him off to Christianity and he decided to explore other religions.

So the time that I met him he was not practicing wicca but he was studying it.

So he kind of explained it a little bit to me so that it wasn't so...

I guess, frightened or suspicious or superstitious, maybe, of the religion.

And so I never practiced it myself,

but I think he did prior to us getting together,

and by the time I met him,

he was sort of moving on to other, like, studying Eastern philosophy and Hinduism and Buddhism and that kind of thing, too.

So, I mean, our relationship took a lot of different spiritual turns and twists.

This might be a good point to back up a little bit in terms of, because you mentioned, and I'll use his word, spirituality.

and or religious beliefs.

At the time that you met Matt, where were you spiritually was a particular religion you were a member of?

Could you describe that for us?

I was not a member of any denomination.

I considered myself Christian.

I didn't And I did know by all the commandments that Christianity has spouses.

Okay, so when you talked about mad and the spirituality, did you be...

become more affiliated with his beliefs or tell us about that.

We sort of explored together and opened up to other beliefs.

We began taking meditation kind new age-type seminars, but they had their roots in Hinduism or Buddhism, maybe some kind of like more modern.

trends and analysis, things like that.

We took these little courses and classes and we would drive to Portland or the Bay Area.

Okay.

Was that a big part of your relationship with Matt?

Yes it was.

This may go without saying because you lived together but was this also a sexual relationship?

Yes.

Did you love me?

Very much.

Yeah, I was in love with him.

this apartment?

Did you both contribute to the finances of the apartment?

Yes, all of the living expenses were split 50-50.

And how long did you and Matt live in this apartment?

We lived in that small apartment for about five months and then we moved Oregon.

Okay, and why did you move to Crater Lake?

The seasonal work there is in the summer.

It's a very high elevation so the snow stays till about July and comes back in October.

So it's a quick season, it's a busy season.

So they have staff housing there at the resort and we got a dorm and stayed there for the season and worked there.

Did you and Matt live together when you were in this dorm as you And this point in time,

then, you're probably several months in your relationship, right?

Yes.

At this point, six I'd say.

I know that.

Probably it's hard to quantify, but was this a serious relationship at this point in time?

Yes, we weren't like heavily discussing marriage, but we were talking about children and what

kind of lifestyle we would have if we decided to have a family.

So, marriage on the table, so to speak?

Yeah, it was a future possibility.

How long in total in terms of your relationship were you together with Matt?

I think approximately a year and eight months.

Okay.

In that year and eight months, did he ever hit you?

No.

Did he ever call you before?

No.

A slut?

No.

Three-hole wonder?

What No.

No.

the end of your relationship with Matt McCartney?

Well, after the first season at Greater Lake, we came back and, ironically, the same exact

department opened up again, so we rented the same place where we lived prior to that.

that we stayed there for some months and we began to sort of argue over little things.

It wasn't anything serious but it wore on a relationship because it just made things not so enjoyable.

So we decided to take a breather from each other, well not from each other, but just from our living together.

So he went back to Crater Lake for a season,

and this time I did not go, I moved to Ashland, which is about 15 minutes south of Medford.

It's in Oregon also.

And let me ask you before you go any further,

these arguments that you spoke, you would have little arguments or things would be get uncomfortable.

Describe what you mean by little arguments because that could mean a lot of different things to different people.

Was there screaming?

Was there throwing things?

No, nothing like that.

It was more like nagging like he would leave us close everywhere and I would be like, you know, and what else?

Sometimes I would leave a dish somewhere in the living room if we were eating.

And it was kind of like more about house, housekeeping and that sort of thing just, you know, living together and those dynamics.

But themselves didn't get volatile from what you're talking about.

No, weren't.

Okay.

Now you're talking about this period in time.

You're starting to have some Discord in your relationship.

Tell us how that discord leads to the end of the relationship.

Well, we decided to spend a little time apart.

We saw each other on our weekends.

He would come into town in Ashland and stay with me.

And I remember I was with his dad's girlfriend,

and she was trying to, I felt sort of like we were distancing, but I was hanging out with them.

I can't remember her name, but his dad's girlfriend at the time.

And we were trying to download pictures onto his dad's hard drive.

And on the desktop, there were some other pictures of this girl.

And I didn't recognize her, but I recognized the setting, and it was inside the lodge at Crater Lake.

And so.

date was also current with this this season which would have been 2001 but it

was just labeled with I guess an initial the letter B so I didn't know who

she was but I wasn't overly concerned about it but you know I just kind of had a

feeling and so I let that go and A few weeks later,

I was working at Applebee's and Two,

I was walking past the table and two people said hi Jodi and I stopped and I didn't recognize them and they explained that they worked with Matt at Greater Lake and they were just in

town for their days off and they,

I just said hi and you know checked on them later as they were about to leave and they said we took a vote and we should something and they told

me that he was seeing a girl named Bianca.

at Crater Lake and so that explained the initial be on that photo and I kind of

said well does she have dark hair and he said yes and so I figured it was her.

Let me answer this what did you do when you had this information?

I was reeling because I mean of all the boyfriends I had I would have expected him to not be

the one that cheated on me.

He was very loyal I trusted him completely like implicitly he could have said this guy is falling and I would have believed him I

out the window to see what it looks like.

But I asked my boss if I could go home a little early and he said that was fine.

So I think I was let go.

It slow.

I let go around seven.

And so we're clear, you were living with Matt at the time.

No, he was living at Crater Lake and I was living in Ashland, so I went home, I changed

my clothes and I decided to, at this time though Matt was, this night Matt was in Virago Springs, California, looking at myself.

very far it's almost by the border and Ashland is up by the other

California border the northern border okay so did you call Matt no need time.

So what did you do once you went home early and learned of this information?

Well I decided that I wanted to find out if it was true so I it wasn't very late.

It's about an hour and a half drive to Crater Lake so after getting dressed I drove up to Crater Lake to see if I could find out.

I had friends that were still there and the people that told me this I didn't know so I wanted to find out from them.

I went,

there were two dorm toys there,

so I went to the one that's closest to the lodge because that one was where people would hang out,

so I could find some people that I knew.

And I ran into a guy, I think, his name was Steve, and I asked him...

Argane the juris having trouble hearing, is anyone having trouble hearing?

I that you reported to the bailiff earlier that you had difficulty yesterday.

Anyone who cannot hear today.

If at any time you cannot hear, please raise your hand and let me know immediately.

I continue.

Okay, Jody, you in the process of telling us you're going to create your lake to find

out whether or Matt was being unfaithful to you.

Right.

I want to continue in the relationship if that was the case.

If it wasn't the case, then of course I would, because I left it.

Did you find out?

that information?

Were you able to confirm it or dispel it?

And how did you do that?

I knocked on Bianca's door and Steve had run to warn her so I could hear them talking and he was very frantic.

How do say this?

Well, he's gay, so he kind of is very, he exaggerates, he's very emotional and he's very animated.

And it kind of made me chuckle because he was, he sounded funny.

And I could tell he, they were nervous.

So she opened the door and I said, hi, are you Bianca?

And I said, yeah.

So she invited me in because she knew who I was.

And so we sat down.

There were two beds in the storm she was seeing with another relative.

They were both from Romania and they were here for seasonal work.

So she sat on her bed, I sat on the other bed and we just talked for about an hour and a half.

Maybe not quite that long, even hour.

And she just told me that she started to hear from the state.

Based on this conversation, we were able to confirm the idea that Matt McCartney and Bianca were having an affair.

Yes.

Well, yes, they were together.

Now, in this hour and a half conversation, were you yelling at her?

No.

It just chit-chat, actually.

I mean, I was trying not to freak out or cry or get upset, you know, because she had no idea.

She was under the impression that he and I were no longer together, so that I didn't look at this as her fault.

How did it feel when you had this information confirmed?

I didn't really allow myself to have much emotion about it until I left her presence and at that point I allowed myself to cry.

And where were you at this point?

And gone back home or is this like out in the parking lot?

Well at this point it was really late so I ended up crashing in my friend Eddie's house.

And he was just, he was kind of a family friend.

He's also, his family is from Wairika.

He's friends with Matt, he's friends with me.

His father also owned a local restaurant.

So we all knew each other.

So Eddie said that you can sleep here and there were two beds in that dorm.

And so I crashed there until about sunrise and then I got up and drove back to my friend.

And at this point in time, when you're driving back to Medford, have you talked to Matt?

No.

When you go back to Medford,

I don't remember the sequence of order, but I also confronted Matt and he confirmed it, and at that point he was honest about it.

Let me ask you this.

You say this confrontation.

Was Matt back in Medford when you got there?

He came back,

but I don't remember if he was there the day that I got back from Crater Lake or if it came the next day or whatever.

And what do you mean by confrontation?

I went over to his dad's house at that I knew what the day he was getting back

and He was on the phone with Bianca when I came over and he hung up and he said I know what

you want to talk about.

And so we went,

we left the house and went to my car so that we didn't,

so that his dad wasn't privy to the information because I think Matt was very embarrassed about it.

So we just talked about it and basically our relationship was over and it was kind of

And when was this again time-wise this would have been September it was right

before September 11 so it was in 2001 I just remember that and was this a heated

confrontation or just it was just emotional we were both crying and this

time in September of 2001 And was that the last time you saw Matt McCartney?

No.

Tell us what happened after you guys, I guess, broke up in September of 2001.

What happened with your relationship?

I wanted to leave the area because Matt and I had a lot of experiences,

mostly all good in that whole Southern Oregon area, all those towns, greater like that entire area.

So it was very, just every corner that I drove and turned, it was sentimental, so I wanted to leave.

So there was a martial arts instructor that I knew, Matt and I knew, and he said that his...

That's the state.

With that telling us anybody what's said, what steps did you take in your life next?

He referred me to another place of employment in Big Sur, California.

And where was that?

Big Sur, California is also in Monterey County, like Salinas.

I'd never been there all the years.

I lived in Salinas.

It's south of Carmel about 28 miles.

And was there a particular resort?

Yes.

What was that?

The resort was called, I think it's still called Bintana and inspa.

Now was that the resort where you met Darryl Brewer?

Yes He applied a job and we're interviewed by Darryl Brewer is that right?

Yes Tell us about that period in your life what you were doing, how you were living.

Well, I drove down there an interview with Darryl.

It was in the afternoon.

I was a little apprehensive about moving all the way out there.

There was no place to live.

There was staff housing at that resort as well, but nothing was open or available at that time.

I was told when there is an overflow of employees,

they are allowed to use the campground if they're open lots because this was in October now.

I think my interview was actually on October 20th because I remember this match birthday.

So during that time that's a slow in Big Sur.

Everything's are slowing down so the campground was mostly all open.

So I was trying,

I was thinking of trading in my car to get a trailer, but I wasn't really in a financial position to do that.

So when Darryl hired me, I kind of scrambled around and went to an outdoor supply store and bought some equipment.

And when Matt heard about what I was doing, he was also looking for work.

The position he saw at previous brings didn't pan out.

So he came down to Big Sur and also applied at Ventana.

Chris, let me understand this as it relates to Matt McCartney.

He said that the breakup conversation wasn't the last time you

It sounds to me like you maintained a relationship with him after you broke up.

Is that correct?

Yes, there was a period after we broke up when we didn't talk for about a week

and then maybe a couple more we would say high briefly on the phone and then not talk again it because it was just our feelings were tender and

it was just kind of a Sticky situation.

He was he was really ashamed of his behavior I think his mother had shamed him a little But eventually we began to talk again,

if that makes sense.

And when he, just so we're clear too, you talked about him.

I guess he was going to live with you in this tent, right?

Yes, he was.

Okay.

And so we're clear, was this the rekindling of the romance, so to speak?

Not really.

I there were blurred boundaries because we were familiar with each other, comfortable with each other.

we weren't actively trying to rekindle a relationship, but there was still a lot of sentimentality.

Were you still sexual with him at this point in time?

One time.

We had sex one more time after we broke up.

After that then it was merely I considered it platonic.

I had some feelings for Anne, but we were not really together and we were just friends at that point.

I got actually two weeks after living in the tent.

I secured employee housing and I think he stayed in the tent for some time and then he got employee housing also.

Okay.

Now what was your job at this resort?

What did Mr.

Brewer hire you to do?

Initially I started as just a server in the restaurant.

There's a restaurant at Bintana.

Okay.

And this restaurant for us.

Do you have any of dannies?

No.

It's considered classified as fine dining.

It once rated four stars by mobile resorts.

It been featured in Condonese Traveler and all kinds of different publications.

It a lot of accolades and it's kind of a resort where high-profile celebrities just to be private and get away from things.

So our guests were treated discreetly and, you know.

Okay, well as far as jobs go, was this a, you talked about you had

a career waiting tables of Denny's and purple plum and all these places was this one of the better paying jobs you've had?

As far as well most servers work for the tips so as far as that goes it was better paying.

There was also a bit a bigger tip out though so when you have a position like that it's not just you you

know taking orders and delivering food you have a lot of help and different people

that make the restaurant run smoothly and so you have a lot of different people

such as the bartender the hostess the lesser that you tip out so even though

that the tip hole was huge at the you know after the tip out I was still

walking away with more than Applebee's so it was it was nicer okay And how long did you remain a server with Ventana?

I think I was there three and a half years.

Was that your only position within the resort?

No.

The following summer in 2002, the wedding coordinator, her name was Arlene Murillo.

She was having stomach pains that she had been ignoring for several months,

and she finally went to the doctor and found out she had pancreatic cancer, and she passed away within a month.

So I filled her position temporarily until they could find a more permanent replacement for wedding coordinator.

And you were acting as wedding coordinator?

And what did that involve?

It involved working with the brides and grooms and how they wanted their reception and their ceremonies set up.

There are a wedding sites at Antana and just negotiating the with them and returning phone calls emails, sending out wedding packages.

for inquiries.

And were you at this point in time when you were waiting for any, were you in a relationship with Darryl Burrow?

No.

Tell us you talked about October 2001.

You go to Ventana.

You're hired by Mr.

Burrower.

tell us about how that relationship evolved.

During that summer, Well, in May, in May, prior to the summer of the restaurant, it was called Cielo at the time.

It closed for remodeling and so we moved the entire restaurant operation over to the inn

and I helped out with that and Darryl was heavily involved with that so we were working

closely together and then also with the wedding coordinate position.

we worked more closely together.

So I began to sort of develop a crush on him but he was my boss so I didn't ever let that on and then at one point he pulled me aside

and said I'm going to resign from my position tonight at I think it was called the briefing.

I it was some kind of meeting we had before the shift started.

So he wanted to let me know that so it wasn't like a shock.

I think he let a few other managers know ahead of time.

And how many months were you working with Mr.

Brewer to your recollection before he told you he was going to resign his position?

Well, I would have been working with him from the day I was hired, so about a year.

Okay.

And but at that point in time it was merely a working relationship.

Was it a friendship?

I wouldn't even call it a friendship.

We kept that separate.

or anything like that, but we just worked together.

Okay.

So he's advising you that he's changing positions.

Do you begin dating then or just describe that for us?

No.

After he stepped down from his management position, he stepped into a supervisory role.

So I still didn't make any moves or he didn't express anything and I didn't express anything.

But then he decided he was going to step out of that role too.

prior to actually doing that we had a conversation where we sort of discovered

our mutual interest in each other but we still didn't do anything because he was

still technically my supervisor and about a week later he stepped out of that position and we went on a date.

Now at that point in time How old are you in 2001 or 2000?

I we're talking about 2002 now, right?

Yeah, I was 22.

And how old was Mr.

Brewer?

He was 42.

How did you feel about dating someone that much your senior?

I wasn't so much concerned about dating him as I was concerned about how other people might view it.

I found Darryl very attractive, he was tall, he handsome, beautiful, is that kind of thing.

We were very compatible, our personalities.

I don't know.

I kind of saw him as like a George Clooney type, like he's older but attractive.

And we had a lot of similar interests.

So I think he was more concerned about the age gap than I was because he was also concerned

about how people might view him for dating somebody so young.

When you began dating him, did you know of his?

did you know he had a son?

Yes, I had seen him a few times at the restaurant.

And did you know that he was divorced?

Yes.

And all those things were okay with you?

It wasn't how I envisioned it, but I guess he can't always control where your heart is going to go.

Everything I discovered about him after the fact that he kept very private that I didn't care for,

but I already loved him so I accepted those things.

Okay.

Before we start talking about those things,

let's talk about the evolution of the relationship from that first date you're still living in

staff housing right yes I am okay it's kind of take us through the process of

other dates how the relationship evolved that sort of thing Okay.

As soon as he stepped down from the supervisory position, we went to San Francisco and went to a 49er game.

We're both 49er fanatics staying from that area.

We just kind of toured the city a little not like a whole bunch of touring,

but we walked around Union Square Being in that business,

you know other people that are in the business So we got a great deal on a hotel room right near Union Square

and It was a good trip.

We just continue to do that and began to come over and hang out on our days off while his son was there So he got a little more used to me.

He very shy when he was younger.

I think I started I came into his life when he was about four four, three and a half more.

Okay, was Daryl living in staff housing as well?

Yes.

Okay.

And you're working together at this time as well?

Yes, he actually became a server, so we're both kind of equal, as far as our position is done.

Do you recall how big a staff there was and at least among the waiters and waitresses there?

Off the top of my head, I'd say maybe 20 people, as far as just the servers.

Okay.

Lots of women employed there.

There were maybe seven other women, I think.

Were you at any point in time in terms of Darryl's interaction with women where you were dating?

Did you get jealous?

Did you get angry at him?

At him?

No, I didn't.

Now, you're going on these dates, you're both living in staff housing.

We about the home you bought together, when did you buy the home?

We bought the house in 2005, I think we closed in June, 2005.

Prior to buying at home, what happened?

We were talking about 2002, you're dating, you're both leaving in staff housing, do live together before you buy that house?

No, no, we had separate apartments.

At that point he had moved back to Monterey, and I had quit Vintana and moved back to Monterey as well.

And we were working on separate jobs, separate apartments.

Okay, and this was in Monterey?

Yes.

Okay.

And you were still a, would there be a point in time?

When you say that you and Mr.

Brewer in a monogamous relationship, what we call boyfriend-girlfriend?

Was there a point in time in that occurred?

Yes, I don't remember the exact point in time, but we were either at in San Francisco

and at one the games or

I can't remember what he celebrated as soon as he was out of his supervisory role we celebrated

and decided to make things official around that time.

Okay.

He was a little nervous about it.

He didn't want to get married, so he made that very clear of right off the bat.

Right off the bat, he told you he didn't want to get married.

Yeah, he made his intentions very clear that he liked me and he was attracted to me and

he was okay with being with me, but he said I don't see myself getting married again.

How did I was young at the time, so it didn't bother me.

I figured I still have many years left, and I enjoyed being with him, so that's what I did.

I enjoyed the time we had together.

And you said just a few moments ago, you said eventually got to the point where you fell in love with Thera.

Yes.

Is there a moment in time,

or is there a point in time that you can describe for us where you knew that was the case?

I don't remember the case.

I the exact moment.

It was a gradual process.

My just became more and more and then I began to really love his son and it just, we progressed in that regard.

I ask because you said you got to a certain point where you're in with him,

but there were all these flaws or things that you had to overlook once you were in love with him.

Could you describe for us what you mean by what you were overlooking, at least from your perspective?

I discovered after I had already developed some deep feelings for him that he was a smoker.

He didn't advertise that.

I never saw him smoking.

The only thing it bummed me out about is that his health.

I thought, okay, it's gonna affect his health.

I he didn't ever smell like smoke.

I never knew it.

So he maintained, he had very good hygiene, but I was concerned about his health.

And I also, he admitted to me one day that he was an alcoholic.

And those were the two big things that we're traveling to you?

Yes, they were.

I didn't ever want to.

I didn't see myself being with a smoker.

There's anything wrong with it, but it was in the lifestyle that I wanted.

My grandparents were chain smokers for a long time, and I saw how it affected their health very negatively until they finally quit.

And I just, I didn't I don't know.

It's one of that kind of lifestyle.

What about the alcoholism?

Did manifest itself during the relationship?

I didn't notice it until after he really talked about it.

We would hang out.

We would watch football during football season.

And we would have dinner at his house.

He was a very good cook.

And I would notice,

after dinner,

he would take some stoli out of the fridge,

or if it's not the thing, out of the freezer, and he would pour himself a drink, and okay, you know, whatever he's just relaxing.

But the hours would go on,

I would go back into the kitchen and throw something away, and there was an entire empty six pack of sea urnavada.

So I didn't see him drink it, and he wasn't changing his behavior.

He was the same, so I didn't assume anything really.

But when he told me about it, he was, one day he was very troubled over it, and was trying to overcome it.

So, despite these, you said, you know, you were in love with him, before you, before you

buy the house, you both living in separate apartments in Monterey, right?

Yes.

Okay.

And are you working?

I was working at an Italian restaurant called Piati.

And also, California Pizza Kitchen had opened a restaurant there, up there, mall.

And so I helped open that restaurant and I was tending bar there.

And to recollection, we were still working.

I don't know why I can't remember.

I he was working in Pebble Beach at a resort in Pebble Beach at the time.

Tell us about the thinking behind the two of you deciding to...

Well, I was, I saw myself eventually becoming a real estate investor.

That's what I sort of wanted to do career wise.

And I, obviously the housing market was taking off in 2005.

So I wanted to buy a home and sit on it for a while and I didn't have,

I had good credit but I didn't have quite the income required for that.

So I was, I began talking to Darrell about it and he also really wanted to buy a home.

The Monterey Peninsula was way out of our reach at that time like a dirt lot was going for 700,000.

So there was no way we were able to purchase property in that area at the time.

Also, I should probably mention he stopped drinking, otherwise I probably wouldn't have considered that.

So he's been sober since 2004.

So we decided to talk about buying a together and,

you I his ex-wife was moving to La Quinta, California, which is in Riverside County, I think, and it's right near Palm Desert.

So we began making plans to move to Sacramento, so she was moving.

We wanted to buy a home, but wanted to stay near her to Monterey and not come all the way down to the desert.

You said you wanted to become involved in the real estate market.

Did you do anything besides just look at purchasing a home?

Did you educate yourself, anything of that nature?

Yes, I took real estate classes at Monterey Peninsula College just to become more familiarized

with the process of real estate,

real estate economics, and I don't remember all the other title of the class I took, but it involved real estate.

So I took those at the same time I was taking more semesters of Spanish.

And to begin studying it and just paying more attention to real estate market trends and looking at listings and things like that.

One of the things we spoke about earlier was,

you know, all throughout high school that you had an interest in art, photography, different mediums of art.

Or was that a business that you were interested in this time or you're more focused on the real estate business?

It was a business that I saw myself developing.

Did it purchasing the home?

Do you remember how much that home cost?

I believe it was $350,000.

And did you and Mr.

Burr have to put down a sizable down payment in order to buy that house?

I think.

I can't remember if we money down, but it was one of those I think it was 100% financed interest only kind of thing.

What was your financial situation at that point in time when you were buying the house?

I was in a pretty solid financial position.

I had a lot of money in the bank safe.

Well, a lot by a lot.

I mean about 10 or 12,000, which I think at that point in my life was the most I'd saved ever.

And I had very good credit.

Darrell had good credit.

But he had a...

I a Roth IRA or something that he was also, you know, saving for retirement.

So he was invested as well.

When did you, if you can recall, when did you move into the home?

I believe it was June 2005 that we actually,

well we were actually going to move to Sacramento and we were looking around the area there.

So we made an offer on a house in Fair Oaks, which is a city out right outside of Sacramento.

And the owners accepted our offer.

We checked out the house.

We liked it.

And the day after our offer was accepted, the plan was we were going to take his son.

And full-time and,

you know,

he would visit his mother in La Quinta and so the day after our offer was accepted she decided that she wanted him to be to come live with

her and continue the same custody agreement.

So at that point the Sacramento area wasn't feasible anymore for Darryl and I wasn't able to buy house without

him and of course I wanted to be with him because we were still together.

Just so we're clear too, she is in this story, she is Daryl's ex-wife, right?

Jack's mother.

Okay.

So I came over to his house the day after,

we're just really high on the fact that we're going to get a house,

and we're excited, and he was just hanging up the phone and he said I don't remember what he said, but he was, um, sorry.

Well, Jody, why don't you get, why don't we talk about the point in time that you make this offer in this house near Sacramento.

You don't get that.

Tell us how.

In the house that you wound up in?

Well, we decided that we needed to be well.

He needed to be nearer to his son.

So we checked out schools and

real estate prices in Palm

Desert Which was more affordable than Le Quinta's Le Quinta's more a high-end community with more expensive property In Palm Desert.

There a very good school day And there were neighborhoods that had houses within our price range that was, that were in that school district.

So we made an offer on a house that I had seen online that I really liked.

So, when you say really like, is this just from a personal perspective or also from a business perspective?

I from the business perspective,

because it was within our price range and a personal perspective,

because just judging from the picture of the house,

it looked like a house that I could see myself living in, of course we needed to see it in person first, but.

So when did you close and move into this house?

This house on Long Desert?

We finally moved there in the summer.

2005 and in terms of the situation how big was this house the house was I

can't remember this square footage somewhere around 1400 maybe 1500 it had three

bedrooms two bathrooms an open floor plan with the living room dining area

and kitchen it had a pool in the back fruit tree is mature landscaping

palm trees a front yard What was the living situation in terms of the bedrooms?

Did you and Derelle share one?

Describe that visit for us.

We had,

well, I had my bed, he had his bed, so we moved them both in and I kind

of kept the master bedroom sort of as my own space and he had another bedroom that he kind of like

when he came home from work he would call it his cave time he needed about 45 minutes to just

decompress and he kind of just veged out in front of CNN or something like that and

then after that we would just sort of hang out.

Did Jack have a bedroom as well?

Yes Jack had the other bedroom.

and how often did Jack live with the two of you?

He came on the weekends two to three days a week.

And from your perspective, do you feel like you had a good relationship with Jack?

Yeah.

We grew closer after moving to Palm Desert.

Yeah, I did.

I a good relationship.

It like a motherly kind of role.

It more like, I guess, having grown up with younger siblings.

Jack felt more like a little brother to me.

And your relationship with Daryl.

At this point in time of 2006,

when you, for 2005, excuse me, when you moved into this home, what was the status of your romantic relationship with Dara?

We were boyfriend, girlfriend, we in a committed, monogamous relationship.

Not necessarily headed for marriage, but I was...

He's saying not necessarily headed for marriage

head Darryl's perspective as you saw it did that change from that initial Advisement I guess that he gave you a couple years prior.

I was not under any impression that he had changed his mind about his position on marriage All right,

ladies and gentlemen, we will take the new recess at this time.

Please be back in the designated area at 125.

Please remember the ammunition.

Have a nice lunch, you are excused.

This area's please take this.

Please be seated, the record will show the presence of the jury, the defendant and council.

Mr.

Nirmay, you may continue with direct examination.

Thank you, Your Honor.

Jody, before we took our lunch break, I we were talking about a point in time when

you and Darryl had purchased your home in Palm Desert, all Yes, okay.

And also told me.

that Darryl's stance on not being married persisted all the way to the point in time when you're buying this home, right?

Yes, I think there was a time when you may have wanted another child, he implied that,

but we never actively tried to get pregnant or anything like that.

So given that Mr.

Brewer not interested in getting married and you had your you know your separate lives your separate bank accounts that you got the

mortgage together what was what was the plan on purchasing this home?

Were you going to live in it for years?

What was what was the idea?

Ideally, if everything had worked out and if the housing market had continued to increase, which of course it didn't, I think June was the year it peaked for the month it peaked,

then we would have stayed in it for two years and either rented it out or flipped it,

turned or I mean sold it and tried to reinvest in another place.

So you didn't have a plan to be permanently together whether married or not you and you.

No, actually I hadn't hoped to maybe buy him out on the house possible so that I could own it and then I had ideas of maybe

making it into a business investment property at this point in time we still in love with mr.

bird you mean while we own the house together yes did you want to

marry dear work I probably would have oh yeah I would have married him I don't know

that I mean he was pretty clear that he didn't want to get married so I

didn't allow myself to entertain that idea but I could see myself spending my

life with him so as it relates to this plan that was hatched,

I guess, or actualized in 2005 to buy the house and stay together in it for a couple of years and make money.

Did that plan work?

No.

It didn't work at all.

Why not?

What happened?

Um...

The day before we signed on our house,

our mortgage broker called and switched up the terms and she said it really fast and we were like okay,

whatever, we just really wanted the house.

So what we failed to remember or consider was that in one year,

the mortgage would index with the current rate and so our mortgage payment jumped from 2,200 a month up to 2,800 a month.

And it was a lot more than we were expecting.

And were you still working two jobs?

Yes, I was working two jobs, yes, in Palm Desert.

So the year half of the mortgage then would have been $1,400, right?

Yes.

Okay.

And that didn't include any of the other household expenses.

No, no other girls, just the mortgage alone, was that?

Okay.

And you,

even between these two jobs,

were making the kind of money that you could afford that,

that's a I think if I might have been able to,

I would have been, I think, living very impoverished if I would, it didn't quite cover the mortgage.

I came up short every month.

So how did you keep paying the mortgage?

I was hoping to earn more money or get another job,

but what I did in the meantime,

assuming that I would be able to pay it back as I started paying the mortgage with my credit cards,

was the value of the home, what was happening with that?

The value obviously wasn't increasing anymore.

I really look into the value of the home I was living in,

but I was paying attention to sale prices in my neighborhood and they were going

for almost $100,000 less at this point than what we closed on our home for.

So it was pretty apparent that the market was back to a buyer's market.

And how long were you and Darryl able to maintain the home with this increased mortgage payment?

I can't remember exactly when it mortgaged, but it went south pretty quickly, as far as being able to maintain the payments.

I think the last solid,

well, the full half of payment that I made was in November 2006, and then by December I couldn't quite get to 1400, and then by January I couldn't pay

I think I paid even less, and I think that was the last time I was able to even attempt it.

And so by then we decided we were going to just let the property lapse into foreclosure.

Moving back a few months to the fall of 2006, what was going on with your relationship with Mr.

Burberry?

We're still to describe that.

Well I still loved him but I think that summer I had a lot of things just kind of reality hit.

We weren't really progressing in our relationship.

I no longer 22.

I 26 now so I began to question where I was going with my life.

Was I going to have a family with this person and so it really didn't seem that way and at

the time my goal was marriage and children,

at least some day and that's not something you can just go out and get something you have to kind of invest time in.

And at age 26, I was more than halfway through my 20s and I wanted to begin focusing more on that.

wasn't sure how that was going to work.

So I became, I guess, a more disenchanted with the relationship.

He wasn't, he wasn't really focused on it.

He had a lot of stress going on with his,

his life and his bills and his son and his ex-wife and that kind of thing.

So we just had, we were going in different ways.

directions with different visions for our futures.

You mentioned personally the things you wanted on a personal level,

but you had also talked about this home purchase being a business venture for you.

Obviously one that wasn't doing so well, right?

Yes.

Did you have other ideas in mind with what you wanted to do with your life from a professional standpoint?

Well, I was looking for other ways to get on my feet financially so that I could

So that I could invest in real estate,

which was going to be in main form of my income,

so I could do other things that I enjoy, which would also be forms of income, such as photography.

And didn't see myself yet making a career out of art, but it was more a hobby than a career goal.

But possibly that.

And I wanted to get my art into galleries,

I wanted to,

I enjoyed the weddings that I had done at Montana,

but I enjoyed photography more than coordinating them, so I wanted to become a wedding photographer also.

Before we go any further into some of your ventures,

we talked about a little bit throughout the course of your life,

we call it your spiritual or religious thinking, you about your two prior boyfriends.

At this point in time and in the fall of 2000s, we Where was your thinking spiritually, religiously?

At that time, I considered myself very open-minded spiritually as far as religions go.

I find good things in all kinds of religions and truths and all religions are things that resonate with me.

And so I didn't have a particular or specific religion that I was identified with or that I considered to be my religion.

It kind of open and broad, but I still considered myself spiritual.

Okay.

Now you mentioned looking for a financial mechanism,

if you will, to allow you to make money while you've worked on your art and your photography, that sort of thing.

thing, right?

Yes.

Did you find one of those or what you thought was one of those?

Yes, the year before I went to work at California Pizza Kitchen one day and

my manager asked me where I saw myself in five years and the first thought that

jumped into my mind was real estate something involving real estate I think I mentioned that.

He said he was gonna be retired which was I thought was kind of a bold statement because he's about my age and so he gave me some

information and it was the company that was then called Prepay Legal I think there was a

magazine and a DVD and he was really excited about it and I thought okay well

he asked me to look at it review it and I told him I would but it wasn't

anything that really got me excited and initially I took it I mean that day at

work I put it next to one of the computer terminals.

it and it stayed at work for several weeks almost a before I remember to finally take it home.

Okay.

Did you watch that DVD?

Not at that point.

I took it home.

I never looked at it.

Well, not never.

I didn't look at it for a long time.

It kind of, it went into a closet and just a storage closet.

And about six months later,

maybe five months later,

I was cleaning it out and I was just cleaning things out and I came across the DVD and I wanted to throw it away,

but I didn't want to throw it away before at least knew what was on it.

So I stopped what I was doing, I popped it into the DVD player and sat down and just gave my attention for that time.

throw it away knowing that I knew it was on it before I threw it away.

And I just liked what I saw and so I called him back and the person who gave it to me, I called him back.

He said he wasn't in the business anymore but he could refer me to his upline and so I got his number.

and then I called that guy and he told me he wasn't in the business anymore

but that he would still get me some more material on it and so I waited a few

days and didn't hear back from him so I finally just went to prepaid legal's

website and submitted my information for to get more information about it.

I think I was able to sign up on the website.

I don't think I signed up then but I submitted my information and a lady named Michelle finally called me back.

And this lady named Michelle that called you back.

Did you know her?

No, not right.

Was this someone who was in your and you were the time that you made this call, right?

Yes.

Okay.

And she and was she this Michelle was she in your area?

she was I think the what happens is when you submit information at least this is

how it used to be you submit your phone number or maybe by zip code or phone number

the referral goes to somebody within your area so she's in the same area code as I

am but a different city she lived in him it okay did you meet with her or tell

us how she called me she was actually at one of the conventions it was March 2006

that I went on to the computer and during a break she got she checked her email and

she got notice of my information and called me right away and told me where

to go to sign up so I went online and I signed up and when she came back from

convention we decided to meet at a restaurant I think it was in Palm

Desert or somewhere halfway let's let's let's before you get too far what do you

mean by you I didn't know what that meant at the time,

but she just instructed me to go online, purchase the membership, and then also pay the fee to become an independent associate with the company.

Okay.

So, you bought their product, and then you pay an additional fee to...

Yes, that's what being an associate means to be able to sell the product.

Yes.

Okay All right, and Why was it that you were interested at this point in time?

of becoming an associate at this company.

I liked what I saw in the DVD, it well.

It was presented very well by two executives

in the company that have had a lot of success and they're very eloquent

and they were able to explain it in very simple terms with simple math

and it just seemed like something that I might have success with.

Okay, so you meet this individual as well.

And are you then involved in selling the product as well or how do you get involved in that?

Well, she sent me away with tons of supplies, DVDs to pass out to other people, magazines, marketing materials,

and I really didn't do anything with it.

I took it home and it sat there and collected dust for a while.

And home, are you still living with Mr.

Brewer that time?

Yes.

And were you still in a...

Boyfriend girlfriend type relationship at that time.

Yes.

Okay, and just I keep saying at that time Do you know about what month and year we're talking about well?

I still in March 2006 at this time when I took me to home and like end of March because she was at the convention and then she came back

So these materials you're telling us they sit, were you actively trying just to sell memberships, what were you doing in regards to prepaid legal?

Not at that point.

She had called me in the summer,

there was a team event at Daniel Summit Utah,

and it was scheduled at the beginning of July that year,

and I was scheduled to go to my cousin's wedding, and I wanted to build my wedding portfolio.

important to me, obviously, and to be with my family for that event.

So I didn't go to that I didn't go to the company event that she invited me to,

but I went to my cousin's wedding and then the summer went by and she called me in early August and asked if I had bought my ticket for

the convention, which occurred in September.

And, um, I told her I had not and she was very adamant that I go and she told me, you know, you can

carpool with us, it's Las Vegas, it's not a hard drive.

So kind of at her behest I bought the ticket reluctantly.

Okay.

In September 2006.

Were you still,

you talked about working two different jobs to pay the mortgage, that sort of thing, was that going on in September of 2006 still?

Yes, I was going to go back to work at Pisto, they closed for the summer for a few months and the owners leave the desert.

they go up to Monterey actually and then it reopens mid September or maybe it's

early when ever school starts there because he had children so around that time the restaurant reopens and I still had my position.

I guess about the time that you purchased the house, you had 10 to $12,000 in the bank.

Was that money still in the bank in September 2006?

No, that was long gone.

So what is your financial situation in September 2006?

Um, it's not, it's paycheck to paycheck.

Um, struggling.

I we're not out on the street or anything,

but, um, I gave up all of the extra things that I liked, um, you know, Starbucks, just things like that.

Just little things that would chip away at your monthly income.

It was everything was very sparse, whatever we could make ends meet.

And your relationship with me.

Is this still going fine or are we still at this dead end that you were describing earlier?

It was something I sort of dreaded because I knew it wasn't going to last.

But we hadn't discussed it.

I don't know where he was with things.

I figured he was kind of in the same realm.

I didn't realize his feelings were as deep for me as he was.

said when he was on the stand,

we had that conversation about a later, or he, about eight months afterward, or he told me that, which surprised me.

I just kind of figured he was in another place and I was in another place.

So, you purchased this ticket for this convention and this was in Las Vegas?

Yes.

Okay.

Was there a specific location for this event?

Yes.

It was held at the MGM Grand.

So, did you then go to this convention?

Yes.

Okay.

And how did you get there?

I drove to Hemet and parked my car at Michelle's house and we took her,

she had a brand new Honda Accord so it was real spacious and she and Lenore and I all drove to the three

of this car.

That's it.

And you mentioned this person, Lenore, was this a friend of yours or a stranger to you at the time?

She became a friend that was the first day I'd met her and she was also a recruit of Michelle's.

So you go off to Las Vegas and these people are virtually strangers to you.

Is what I'm hearing?

Michelle and I would talk occasionally in text.

I comfortable around her.

She was almost my mother's age, maybe slightly younger.

So I was comfortable around her, but I didn't know her very well.

And to this point in time it sounds like you hadn't been active in the Is that accurate?

Other buying a membership?

Yeah.

That's true.

Alright.

Wasn't really looking forward to going, but I figured I should get an honest shot.

Okay.

Did you know anyone else that was going to be at this convention besides the two, your two I'm sorry.

Did you know anyone else at this convention besides the people you were traveling there with?

No.

Okay.

Well, tell me about, tell us about.

What happened when you arrived there?

When we arrived, we checked in.

There was just a swarm of people everywhere with all their luggage.

They were all other associates that were checking in.

There are like, it's a convention of about, I think, at the time there were about 12,000 people.

So it's in Canada and the US,

so all kinds of people from all different walks of life descend onto the MGM brand for this convention.

at the MGM ground, but everyone stays around in Las Vegas, so there were a lot of people checking in.

We got to our room, we just kind of relaxed for a while and walked around, got lunch, and later got dinner.

He said our room, what was the...

accommodations.

Were sharing it with these two ladies?

Yes.

Okay.

And...

I was also, I can't remember, I think they were four of us.

Okay.

Now did you get there on the day that convention began or were you there?

in the convention.

We came, well, the convention is on a Friday and Saturday and we showed up on Wednesday night.

Okay.

And what would, to your understanding anyway, what were you to do at convention?

Were attending classes, attending meetings?

What was your purpose in being there?

I didn't understand,

I didn't understand what,

I didn't know what to expect,

I had never been there before,

she just told me it's going to be a great event,

it's going to get you fired up, I had never attended a convention, not that convention, so I didn't really know what to expect.

Okay, and how long are you going to be?

Well, we were going to leave Sunday, so if I do still.

Okay.

Is that when the convention ended?

No.

My understanding was that it went all day Friday, all day Saturday.

And there were smaller team events outside of those.

Okay.

And was there a particular team that you were to be involved with at this convention?

Michelle was on Team Freedom, so when she recruited me that made me part of Team Freedom.

No, I'm sorry, I take that back.

It was Team Renew.

Sorry, there's a lot of different teams in the company.

Team I think was the name.

What happened?

You said you went in your room, you relaxed, what did you do next?

We just wandered around a little.

We went out to the swimming pool.

There a lot of people there.

I didn't bring a bathing suit.

I even think we were, I was thinking business.

So felt, I don't know, it was a hundred degrees and everyone was out and bikinis hanging out.

I felt awkward when I was just standing there in my business clothes.

I was getting introduced to a lot of people.

I really keep track of everyone.

There a lot of names.

And so you had another whole another day before the convention started?

Yes, there was Thursday and then on Friday was when the convention started.

So what did you do?

Thursday.

On Thursday Michelle Lenore and I just went I don't remember the whole day but I remember we were at we got dinner at Applebee's across town we just were

having dinner we just killed time just doing things morning around town.

Were you meeting more associates though as well?

Yeah before we went Before we left the MGM Grand,

we walked around and met more people, and I was introduced to more people that she knew.

So there weren't any meetings or anything on Thursday, is right?

I wasn't aware of any,

but later in that evening I learned that there was a banquet that occurs the night before convention, and that's the executive director banquet.

While you were at this convention, did you ever meet an individual by the name of Travis Alexander?

Yes.

Describe for us where you were and what was going on when you met Travis Alexander.

On Wednesday night, this would be early September 2006.

Michelle and I,

Michelle Lenore and I were with her mother and I think two other associates and we were all sitting around this round table at the Rainforest Cafe which is inside the

Casino Hotel.

We were having dinner and we were finishing up dinner, paid, our check, and we left.

We didn't leave the Rainforest Cafe,

we could sort of stay in this kind of lobby area, I know, we were right outside the entrance, still indoors.

and there's just tons of people everywhere.

A lot of them are pre-paid legal business associates so I'm just I'm standing I'm staying close to Michelle

she's the only person I really know and I'm meeting other people that are on my

team and she introduces me to people that are in my upline and things like that

and there was just a crowd of people everywhere and out of the corner of

my eyes saw somebody walking toward me kind of fast-paced and I

I he was going similar because he looked like he had a purpose so I

stepped out of the way because I thought he needed to walk past me but he stopped

right in front of me and stuck his hand out and introduced himself.

And was that Travis?

Yes.

What happened from that point in time?

Um, I shook his hand and tried to just log the name because there were a lot of people that I was meeting that weekend.

Um, so we just kind of milled around the outside of the rainforest cafe a little longer, and then our group began to wander.

just past restaurants and sports bars and then slot machines and all that kind of thing.

And you say your group, does that mean the people you went to the restaurant with?

Yes.

And just so we're clear, Mr.

Alexander part of the lunch you had or dinner, excuse me, at the rainforest cafe.

No, he wasn't.

Did he then follow your group around the MGM?

He made it a point to walk with us.

He was also on team renew, but more like laterally, he was obviously hired as an executive director as far as position in the company.

But so he knew all these people.

He had met them all before.

But as we wandered through up Xino, he made it a point to walk next to me and keep me engaged in conversation.

OK.

Was this late in the evening when this was going on?

It was dark out, I think, but I don't recall it being very late.

How did you part company with Mr.

Alexander that evening?

After wandering around, we kind of wandered back to the lobby, where there's a big golden lion statue, and took pictures there with some people.

And after a while,

I kind of noticed that I had been ignoring everyone else in the group and just see and I were talking, talking, talking.

And at one point there was a lull in the conversation and it kind of felt like everyone was staring

at us so it was a little awkward.

So I sort of began to talk to other people.

And sorry.

No, go ahead.

Tell them.

Okay.

I don't remember how he parted,

but just said goodbye,

and Michelle Lenore and I went back to our hotel room and I didn't really think anything of that meeting,

but I think it was Lenore pointed out that she thought maybe he liked me,

which made me think differently, I guess, about reflecting on our conversation because I didn't get that vibe from him.

Did you speak after your party company?

Did you speak to Mr.

Alexander that night?

Not that night.

And when did you next speak to Ms.

Drowd's answer?

Well, while Lindor and Michelle and I were at Applebee's having dinner, Michelle's phone

ring, and she answered it, and I only heard her half of the conversation, and then she

had that and asked me and just told me that Travis wants to know if I would go to the executive director banquet with him.

And we this earlier,

but from your perspective,

at least perhaps I should say it this way, in your perspective at the time, did you even know what an executive director's banquet was?

No.

When Michelle mentioned it, that was the first I heard about it.

And what did you come to understand that it was?

Eventually I came to understand that it's kind of a, it's a banquet where everyone dresses up.

The women are dressed to the ninth men are usually in tuxedos.

It's kind of an upscale banquet with multiple courses, and generally they're that other people give out the banquet while you're dining.

Now once this invitation came to you, let me ask were you in any way prepared to attend such a banquet?

No.

I turned him down and said, I didn't want to go because I didn't.

Once I found out that it was, you know, something where you have to dress up for, I didn't bring anything for that.

So I said, thanks anyway.

But no thanks because I didn't.

We were on the other side of Las Vegas.

The would start in less than an hour and I just didn't see how I could get addressed.

our traffic all in that span of time so and this would have been Thursday evening

yes this is Thursday night did you end up attending that banquet I did explain

to us how you went from

the point in time when you said I don't have anything to wear it's

across tenants in an hour to actually attending the bank but how did that happen?

Well after I said I didn't after I said no Michelle was very she encouraged me she

said it would be a very good experience for me there are lots of executives that

I think her idea was to get me inspired to become more active in the company and get

me more excited about the company and both Lenore and Michelle very encouraging saying that you really should go.

This is a very good opportunity.

Not everyone gets this opportunity.

So I kind of just said, okay, well, we got to find something for me to wear.

So we ran around town.

I Coles was near Applebee's.

I didn't know if there were any suitable dresses at that store.

But we went in there and grabbed a few things off the rack, tried them on.

Nothing was really working out.

So I was I was probably going to call him that.

Well, actually, I did call him right before that and said, OK, I don't have a dress, but I'm going to for one.

And I'll let you know.

And so I was in the dressing room at Coles, by that point he had my cell phone number.

And so he called me and said, did did you win up on the dress?

Did you end up obtaining a dress to wear this banquet?

Yes, his friend packed an extra dress and she was the same size as me and I guess

she heard about his predicament and said that I could wear that dress.

Did you find it strange that Mr.

Alexander asking you to this band?

I didn't really think of it as strange.

I think the whole week was kind of strange.

It wasn't really what I was accustomed to, so I was just going with the flow.

So tell us how you...

Obtain this dress and what happens as you're going from Coles to the banquet?

After I realized there was a dress at the hotel,

we dropped everything at Coles,

hopped in the car and got on the freeway,

and it was very slow traffic,

but we just made it all the way back to the MGM Grand, and we rushed up to the hotel room where the dress was.

I changed and Travis Metney there,

Michelle and I there, and we walked across the complex over to the ballroom where the banquet hall was being held.

I'm sorry where the banquet was being held in the ballroom.

Who's dress was it that you were borrowing?

Um, his friend's wife's guy used.

And you know Miss Hughes prior to coming to her room and borrowing her dress?

No, I had not met her.

And you mentioned his friend Chris Hughes.

being Skye's husband had you met Chris Hughes prior to this event.

No.

When you went to, let me ask you this, was Mr.

Alexander in the room when you changed?

You ready?

He might, I he showed up.

I was in the bathroom changing.

Tell us what this banquet was like for you.

It was nice.

I somewhat accustomed to that level of dining because of my serving experience, but I was always a server, not the guest.

I was very familiar with just how the courses run and table etiquette and that sort of thing.

So that was not really,

it didn't move me a lot,

but what was interesting was all of these people that were there and how successful they all were and that kind of opened my eyes to

that you really can be a successful news

company and it's not just implied by night company or any kind of get rich quick scheme or things like that.

Any kind of what was that?

Like a get rich quick scheme, that's not what it was.

It legitimate.

it sounds to me like then that you were to some degree getting intoxicated by the success you were saying.

Is fair to say?

I don't know if intoxicated quite be right but it definitely made a big impression on me.

Um, it stuck out in my mind, Travis also challenged me, he said every person they take to the executive.

Okay.

Mr.

Harris, do people at this banquet encourage you to become more involved in prepaid legal?

Yes.

Was Mr.

Alexander one of those individuals that encouraged you?

Yes.

He encouraged me the most of everybody.

Tell us in terms of, you talked about the dining and things of that.

Did you have any idea when you went to this banquet or did you learn during the course

of this banquet what an executive director meant in terms of income level?

I had an idea, there were people there giving their, they're called ring speeches.

That means that they earned $100,000 within a one year period.

So when you do that, you earn a ring to symbolize that or to show that.

So that's a huge milestone in the company that a lot of people strive for.

And Travis did not have his ring.

He came close.

At one point, he said he made almost 80 grand.

I couldn't hear the last statement.

Let's restate the question.

To your right, thank you.

May proceed.

To your understanding, how did Mr.

Alexander the ability to invite you to this Executive Director's Bank?

He wouldn't have to be an executive director to have tickets, so that meant that he qualified for that position.

And to your understanding, what did qualifying to that position mean?

It meant that he had a certain level of production in the company, as far as selling memberships.

I believe that was my understanding of it.

But you also mentioned something about a ring.

To your understanding that this banquet was something different than being an executive director.

Yes, because you can be an executive director and still not be earned in $100,000 or actually anywhere near that is my understanding now.

Did Mr.

Alexander give a speech?

a banquet?

No.

Did other people that he was with or people that he knew?

Did they make speeches at this banquet?

People made speeches and he may have known them but I don't know what their relationship was to him.

The level of income of the people in the room.

It seemed like from what Mr.

Circe told us that was pretty well known.

Is that correct?

There's no discussion you, but we're seriously here to be honest with you.

We'll state the question.

Did you have an understanding, or was there any publications that talked about how much money these people were making?

Yes, some of the people are known to, well, you get a ring when you earn $100,000, when

your income reaches $250,000, you a diamond embedded in the ring.

When your income reaches $500,000, you get two diamonds, and when your income reaches a million dollars a year, you get three diamonds.

So and then there are people who earn beyond a million dollar mark.

I don't know if there is any kind of outward symbol for that or not.

But you were learning.

While you were president this banquet, right, all these figures, these income figures, right?

Yes, people were mentioning their lifestyle and their speeches that's incorporated.

Their lifestyle helped, things changed, how they struggled, or how they're having success now and they threw out numbers.

Did that speak to you in terms of your current system?

situation or your situation as it relates to September 2006.

Yes.

Let's talk about that a little bit.

What sorts of,

in general,

not specifically what they said,

what sort of What sort of statements did they make about the lifestyle in terms of with prepaid legal

out long and took to make money, those sort of things?

Their lifestyle, they no longer struggled, was the impression that I got.

They no longer worried about paying the bills, they no longer worried about where their money would come from.

They were more concerned with things of a higher nature,

I guess you could say, like philanthropy or who they could turn around and bless now that they've been blessed.

and constructive ways they can now use their income to better society.

And that was something that also spoke to you?

Yes, very much.

After this banquet, what did you, did you and Mr.

Alexander stay together?

After the banquet, we left the banquet room, it was like a big ballroom.

And everyone sort of mails around outside and takes pictures with people,

and so Travis took me around to a few different executives,

and I got my picture taken with a bunch of people and him,

and we just did that,

and after that I changed out of,

well we went back to the room, and I changed out of the dress and back into regular clothes.

Okay.

Without telling me specifically what he said during this evening with Mr.

Alexander, did you get the sense that he had a romantic interest?

not really he wasn't really flirting with me wasn't giving off that but I did get

the impression that he was trying to impress me because he was talking about

income and but he was talking to the guy next to him but he was saying it

very loud so I got that impression but not that he was trying to like woo me that makes sense During that evening,

did you learn anything else about Mr.

Alexander where he lived, his family, his family.

Did you learn things like that about him?

He didn't talk about his family, but the night before he talked about, he said it from Riverside.

I'm sorry I didn't hear that.

He was from Riverside.

Okay.

He told me it was a 49er span, which I kind of didn't believe because he was from Southern California.

Most people like the Chargers in that area.

But it had to do with Steve Young, I guess it was a member of the church in a very good quarterback.

Um.

me about the UFC if I was familiar with it that was an interest he had and I was familiar with it somewhat.

And USC is that an acronym for something?

Yes it's an acronym for Ultimate Fighting Championship.

And is that what we would call cage fighting?

Yes.

Cage fighting.

No hold hard.

Okay.

And it sounds like you mentioned that you mentioned the church, did he convey his faith to you?

not that evening we went to convention on Friday.

He had invited me to sit down on the floor where the executive director said it's just a bunch of chairs set up so it's closer to the stage instead of a stadium seating.

And so we're clear this is the day after the banquet right?

Yes this is the Friday morning.

I had a ticket which was it was with Michelle and I got a text message from Emma so there's an open

seat down here if you want to sit closer to the stage.

Okay and from your understanding this would be an area

Sound like what you were telling us is an area that you wouldn't otherwise be able to sit, is that?

Yes, you needed a special pass to get into that area.

Okay, and do you know why?

It's reserved for executive directors only, so you have to be qualified for that position in order to get into that area.

Okay.

And I'm sorry.

What did you call this?

You said it was a meeting or what was this about Friday?

It was I guess I would call them sessions like there's a morning session and an afternoon session

and For those of us who haven't been to one of these sessions with prepaid leaders What does this involve?

Is there a huge number of people?

Yes, it fills up.

It's a big stadium.

I know how big, maybe football size.

Maybe not quite that big, but it's pretty huge.

Just so we're not talking the size of a football stadium, right?

No, but it holds a lot of people.

over 10,000.

I it can hold like 15,000 people with the floors.

Okay, so please go on there.

So that was filling up.

I decided to make my way down.

I don't remember how I got there.

I think he met me at the area and took me over to where the seat was.

And I went.

and sat down there and the event starts with the national anthem and then the

Canadian national anthem because they represent the companies in both countries.

And just different things get started there's it's kind of mixed up

there's training entertainment so I mean it's like it's not entertainment but

it's their speeches I think they point they use the term entertainment because it's them entertaining training I guess you could say Anyway,

we just looked at these, I mean I just watched these speeches and took notes in my journal and took pictures, that kind of thing.

What were these,

and I'm not even going to try to repeat the work because I'm sure I'll butcher it, but this entertainment slash training, what was that?

from your perspective, designed to do it?

It's designed to, well, you get more training.

Sometimes there are new products that they roll out,

and they train on that, but at the same time, it is designed to not be boring also.

It's that you usually riveted to.

There's a lot of note-taking.

Some people come out and just rally up the crowd.

They're very good speakers.

They have a lot of energy.

The ring speeches that were heard at the night

before also set on stage again so that all the associates that were unable to attend the banquet also get to hear those speakers.

inspiring because there's success stories and is this this meeting and this large facility, is this something that lasts all day?

Yes, we start, I don't remember the time,

we start somewhat mid to early morning, go into lunch, break for lunch, and then come back in the afternoon until late afternoon.

Okay, did you have lunch with Mr.

Alexander?

No, that day I didn't, I went to get sushi with Michelle.

when you go back to this meeting do you then return your seat near mr.

Alexander yes I think I think he invited me one more time so then after that I just stayed

in that seat for the rest of the convention did the entire convention

you said the rest of the convention did the entire convention take place in

this one large room yes okay so you spent the entire two days sitting next to

him at this convention yes did you have dinner with him that that that what would be I guess Friday night Not Friday night.

No, we didn't.

I don't really remember Friday night actually.

Tell us about Saturday night.

Okay, Saturday I was again getting lunch with Michelle and we started texting each other sort of back and forth.

By this point I was pretty, it was pretty clear that he liked me more than friends.

Not wasn't being overtly flirtatious but And I decided that, well Michelle told him that I had a boyfriend.

Did you have a boyfriend at the time?

Yes, I was still with Durham.

Did you know, to your understanding, was Mr.

Alexander aware of the fact that you had a boyfriend?

Yes.

Overrolled, you answer.

Yes, he was aware.

And you were just telling us that you got a sense of Mr.

Alexander an interest in you that wasn't strictly business, right?

Yes.

And you mentioned you were getting that sense.

What things did he do to give you that sense?

He was texting me after the banquet.

He said really nice things.

You're a great girl.

Sorry.

You for the truth of the matter.

It's the fact of the listener.

He was friendlier and friendlier but not inappropriate,

but after I learned that he already knew I had a boyfriend and he continued to act that way,

I thought it would be,

I thought I needed to pull him aside and tell him that I have a boyfriend so that he didn't get it.

me.

Okay.

And did you do that?

Yes.

And when was that?

That was Saturday night.

We have dinner at the Rainforest Cafe again.

The team renew met.

They reserved the upper floor of the Rainforest Cafe.

We all had dinner there and then hung out in the food court after that and just talked

for a long time and then we went.

I texted him earlier and said, I'd like to talk to you later.

What motivated you to, or I shouldn't say that, how did you arrange this conversation with Mr.

Alexander?

I indicated that I would like to talk to him when the time is appropriate, alone, and he said okay.

So we were hanging out in the court.

He asked me do you want to go for a walk and I said I thought this would be

my opportunity to talk to him so we started going for a walk around the casino.

It was very late, it was about one o'clock in the morning at that point and we started wandering near the stores.

They're all closed at that point so there are plenty of people over in the casino area where all the soft machines

are but this end of the building was kind of empty.

So as we walked I explained to him that I had a boyfriend and I told him I liked him but I'm in a relationship and I explained a little bit about the

state of my relationship.

I didn't go into a lot of detail.

I What do you mean by you explain to him the state of your relationship?

I didn't go into a lot of he's my boyfriend.

That's what I said.

I I'm monogamous so I'm with Daryl and with Daryl not anybody else.

Did he respond in any way to what you were saying?

He smiled and...

He was aware that that's what I was,

well he assumed that's what I was going to talk to him about and so at that point it was clear I thought and I was able to relax a little

more and just be friends and so we found a park bench,

it was kind of like a park bench against a wall at that end of the building and we sat down and ended up talking for a

few more hours just about everything.

commenting on the What you should do regarding your current relationship Did he advise you that you shouldn't settle for what you are?

were dealing with.

Overroaching the answer, yes or no?

Yes.

While you were out on this batch, was this outside or inside?

Indoors.

And you said, the two of you sat and spoke for a couple of hours.

Yes.

Did you talk about religion or faith during that period of time?

Yes, the topic did turn to religion.

Did he share with you his membership in the Mormon Church?

Yes, I know that he was Mormon at that point.

Michelle said it as if to warn me.

Like it should be a warning.

I know what that meant because I wasn't familiar with the Mormon Church.

I didn't know it.

I just assumed it was another Christian denomination, like any other.

And I didn't really...

I mean, I've heard about Mormonism over the years.

Mormonism is the butt of a lot of jokes on South Park, and some people just seem very antagonistic toward Mormons.

I understand that I...

It's a state.

concerns about being around Mr.

Alexander of his membership or practice of the moment.

No.

Not at all.

Someone's religion wouldn't affect that at all.

Did he?

express a desire for you to learn more about his faith.

No, he not, he implied it, but he didn't openly start proselytizing or anything.

During this conversation at the bench in the MGM, did he ever attempt to kiss you?

Not there on the bench now.

But he did that night?

He leaned in very close as if he wanted to kiss me and he was looking his lips and he

was staring at my lips and like he wanted to kiss me but he didn't.

And where did this occur?

On the elevator.

How close did he do to you again?

Well, we got on to the elevator and...

She should have asked how close did he get?

Sustained.

How close did he get to you?

He got right in my head.

I would say four inches maybe five okay and this wasn't forced based on the size of

the elevator right no the elevator was empty at one point there's someone else

that stepped on but large elevator yes and he got within four inches of your face he He put his skin on the slope, sustained.

Once he got within four inches of your face, with his face, was that right?

Yes.

What did he do?

Um, he licked his lips and said I wish you didn't have a boyfriend.

Sustained.

Did you kiss him?

No.

Did he make contact with you?

Physical contact?

Yes.

How?

He put his arm around me when he walked me back to my hotel room.

When he walked you back to your hotel room?

Yes.

Did he attempt to kiss you again?

No, he seemed very obvious to me.

No, actually that's not what you said.

Overall, do you mean?

He made it very obvious that he wanted to kiss me, but he, like he was restraining himself.

It was very obvious for restraint.

And did he attempt to invite himself into your hotel room?

No.

and did you have still have roommates per se for the hotel room?

Yes, Michelle and Lenore, and I believe her mom were inside sleeping at that hour.

And this would have been late Saturday night, early Sunday night, right?

Yes.

Is this the last you see of Mr.

Alexander when you're in Las Vegas?

No.

After that evening, when was the next time we saw him?

Sunday morning, they had what's called a breakout, and it was in a small theater near the MGM Grand within walking distance.

So team, I guess, I think it was Team Renu, maybe a few other people not on that team weren't present.

I saw him there.

I didn't sit next to him.

And in met, where was he when you saw him?

He was at the theater, and I was at the theater, and then he invited me to, what invite you to do?

He invited me to go to,

it was a buffet of some kind, back at the MGM, where he and a few other people were having breakfast.

And he And then, to to And then, to he invited And then, the Did you accept his invitation to have practice?

Yes.

And you said this was Mr.

Alexander other individuals, right?

Yes.

Were these people you knew previous to this point in time or were these four individuals who were leading?

I believe I admit them over the weekend they were people on my team and in my upland.

Okay.

The friends that you came with drove from California with were they at this breakfast?

No.

Where were they to your knowledge?

I don't know I don't know where they went after the breakout.

this breakfast with mr.

Alexander was that the last time you saw him no well ethnic image no okay I stay with him till you left I think okay

and what did he do after breakfast, or did he leave right after breakfast?

We walked over to the front desk where he checked out,

and we walked out to the front where there were valets,

and he was loading stuff into the taxi and getting ready to go to the airport.

We're there.

Arrangements made for you to do have contact with each other again.

How did you leave things with Mr.

Alexander?

Yeah, he indicated he would call me.

I didn't really expect him to call me, but that's kind of where we left it.

We hugged.

Did he attempt to kiss you before he got into the taxi?

No.

When did you leave?

the convention.

Michelle and Lenore and I checked out a few hours we got lunch at the Rainforest Cafe again and then we checked out after that.

Okay and I presume you drove back to California?

Yes.

After you arrived back in California, you were still living in the home with Darryl, right?

Yes.

Was it back to work, or what did you do when you got back.

I did have to work just back in the same routine except Travis began to call me.

At this point in time when you came back to California to Palm Desert specifically, did you still consider Darbera or Darbera?

Were you still sexually active with Mr.

Brewer you came back from the convention?

No.

Why not?

I don't know, recall specifically why.

Oh, well, because we broke up, I guess that would be why.

But we didn't have sex after convention.

I that was prior to that was the last time that we did.

prior to the convention.

Yes.

And you talked about breaking up with Mr.

Brewer, when did you do that?

Well, I got back from convention on Sunday and I broke up with Darryl on Thursday of that week.

Why did you break up?

with Darryl after he came back from the convention?

The relationship was already, like I mentioned, was of fizzling.

I loved him very much, but there was no, it wasn't going anywhere.

At least we had different visions for our futures.

Because it had been like that from day one,

it took me four and a half years to really just let it go, because I really loved him.

Also, on Wednesday night, I invited to go out to some of Travis's friend's house,

and I knew Travis would be there,

and I didn't want to…I'm kind of like…one guy at a time kind of person,

so I didn't want to have anything overlapping, and I knew there was an interest with Travis, and I was beginning.

just the seeds of interest with Travis and I didn't want

to be in a relationship when I went there because I didn't want there to be anything hindering.

I don't want to feel guilty for flirting or sitting next to him or doing any of that.

I wanted to be out of a relationship so that I could not cheat on anybody.

Would that make sense?

Would it be correct to say that then from what you're telling us, Mr.

Alexander motivated you to break up with Darrel Vooror.

The things he said made a big impression on me wasn't just about relationships,

it was about my whole life, my career, and the direction of my life.

So it made me step back and take a look at where I stood and where I was going.

So that was part of the reason.

interesting.

You said you came back with a different vision of the future.

You came back from the convention with a different vision of the future than when you left, right?

Yes.

Describe for us, if you could, what was your vision of the future before you went to this convention in September 2006?

It was kind of an nebulous.

It wasn't very clear.

I knew that I wanted to, basic things.

I knew I wanted to have kids someday.

I knew I wanted to be married someday.

I knew I didn't want to struggle paycheck to paycheck.

I didn't see myself living in life with excess,

but definitely being able to pay the bills and provide for families somewhat or just at least be a joint contributor to the household.

I saw myself getting more into photography and hopefully in the being successful in real estate, eventually.

And when you come back from convention, What's your vision of the future?

I still have those desires, but leaving convention, I can't really describe it.

It painful, actually, because I knew that there was a lot of change on my horizon at that point.

I couldn't continue with the same life that I had been living because it's kind of like my eyes were opened

to a lot of things that I had been ignoring.

And I The change, the idea of change was uncomfortable.

I really loved Darryl, but I couldn't continue with him.

That sounds more about things on a personal level.

But what about your vision for your future on a professional level?

Were believing?

Leaving this convention that prepaid legal was going to make you rich

It the idea of selling the membership was uncomfortable to me I believe the product, but just hitting up my friends and family seemed awkward.

So I had that desire, but I couldn't quite see myself going out and doing it, at least yet.

So Michelle invited me to.

event a week later and it kind of reiterated some of the things I had seen at

convention and I continued to go to these events from then on I became

more active as far as plugging into those events and how to sell the membership and

how to have success and the general vision of it became more crystallized in my mind.

general point in time then when you decided that to,

for lack of a better phrase, go all in in pre-paid legal in terms of your future.

I had moments, I had periods in the company where I was very productive and the money I made was surprising.

I didn't realize the compensation plan was as generous as it was and I liked that but I found it difficult to maintain that level of production every month.

Were you still working other jobs?

Yes.

Did you eventually get to a point?

where prepaid legal was your only job?

No.

How much did you make in a year with prepaid legal and you say your most productive year?

I really didn't make

anything for several months at a time and then one month I made approximately

1700 in the next month I made I want to say a little over a thousand so those two

months are really good How much time a week were you spending investing in your pre-paid legal business?

Not nearly as much as I should have been.

They have goals in the company,

things that they'd like you to commit to,

such as talking to other people about a minimum number of people per day or per week,

and remember them now because it's been so long but just different.

They're called 10 quirk commitments at least that's what they were called then and they tell you

that if you just do these things systematically then success follows.

How many hours a week were you working at the restaurant?

At that time, I was still a full time at Christo, but eventually I quit that job, and then I only had one job.

you broke up with, I want to go back to this conversation you had with Darryl.

Would you guys sit down in the two of you talk about the relationship?

Yes.

I guess I wasn't as specific as I thought I had been.

It sounded like he didn't get that impression, but we sat down, I actually had a conversation with him.

We sat at our kitchen table,

and I just told him,

in essence,

I told him I know we're not getting married,

but you know I'd like to have kids someday,

and he said okay,

and I Um,

I think maybe we should,

um, I might want to start pursuing that goal and I know that you don't want to pursue that goal with me and that's okay.

Um, I know you're, he was moving back to Monterey.

I I know you're moving back soon.

So I kind of just left it at that.

I think it very specific.

But he was nodding his head like he understood what I was saying.

So I was under the impression that he understood that we were no longer together at that point.

I mean, not in a committed relationship where we are boyfriend, girlfriend.

And you mentioned doing this.

prior to being invited to spend a weekend in California with Mr.

Alexander, right?

Actually, did it right after I was invited, but prior to going?

Prior to you going to California or Prior to this breakup,

had you had any other interaction with any officials from the Mormon Church in your home?

Not at that point.

So tell us about When was this trip to California or somewhere else in California to take place?

This would have been the weekend after convention.

And where was it?

how many hours from you was it?

I don't remember the drive not far it was in Marietta,

California either Marietta or Temecula I think Marietta and I'd say an hour and 15 minutes maybe and who's home or you go

I was going to Travis's friends and their names are Chris and Skye.

Is that Chris and Skye?

Here's where the dress came from.

Yes.

As it relates to, at this point in time, did you have an understanding where Mr.

Alexander left?

Yes, I knew he lived in Mesa.

Did you feel comfortable going to Nirietta to spend this, I guess it was a couple of days?

in this home of people you barely knew?

I had met the Hughes's at convention, and they seemed like very nice people.

So I wasn't, I was a little uncomfortable, but not in a bad way, just shy.

But I didn't feel unsafe or anything like that.

I just, there was gonna be a there.

I believe Mr.

Hughes's brothers were moving to Colorado, so it was sort of a going-way party and Sky's brother also returned from his mission.

So it was kind of a, and then all the creepy legal associates were there.

So it was kind of a party with multiple purposes.

We were all just there gathering, because it's like a social gathering.

Was it your understanding?

You said a social gathering.

Were there as one of the party guests per se?

Are we there?

Just a party guest did you spend a lot of time with Travis over the I'm not at first.

I got there while the party was in progress and hung out for a while.

Michelle was there so I felt comfortable a little bit and eventually she left.

It had been discussed ahead of time and this was on a Saturday, this party that I could stay the night.

They had an extra bedroom and they wanted me to attend church with them in the morning.

So I agreed to that and Travis actually wasn't there at the party.

He was late and he showed up.

after almost everyone had left.

Did you spend time, this, what would have been Saturday evening before church?

Did you spend time with Mr.

Alexander on Saturday evening?

Yes.

Was it just the two of you or were there other people involved?

At first it was Travis and I,

we were sitting on an oversized chair and Chris and Skye and one other guy named Jeff,

I can't remember his last name at this point.

We were all sitting in the living room watching a funny video that Travis had.

filmed.

At this point in time, had you kissed Mr.

Alexander?

No.

When did you first kiss Mr.

Alexander?

We all went to bed and he came into the bedroom I was staying and I assumed there was probably

going to be some kissing or some kind of talking or hanging out.

We talked every night that entire week.

So that's when we kissed.

I want to clarify too as well.

You just said something.

You you talked to Mr.

Alexander every night.

What time period are you referring to?

The time from the Monday after convention till Friday night.

So, we called you after convention every single night.

Yes, that's what we're going to say.

We for the talk.

Refrais.

How do you do in Mr.

Alexander up communicating all these nights between convention and its invitation to you?

Well, I was at my home in Palm Desert, and was at his home in Mesa, so he called.

Did he call you on your cell phone or a home phone or?

My cell phone.

And about what time of the day?

If there was a consistent time of the day, was he calling in?

The first night he called around 8 o'clock,

and then toward the end of the week,

it began to get a little bit later, not inappropriately, maybe just 9.30, a little closer to 10.

He learned my schedule, and I usually worked in the afternoons, so it wasn't a big deal that he called that late.

What was he calling about?

We just talked mostly about,

well he told me a lot about himself and his dog,

his religion, his his friends, he lots of funny stories he would share and he wanted to know about me.

He wanted to know about Darryl, he wanted to know different things about my life.

These conversations you've had with him over these days after the convention, is that part of what you meant by...

his words encouraging you to break up with Darabur.

Will you say that again?

I'm sorry.

You talked about how some of the things that Travis said to you encouraged you to break up with Darabur.

Yes.

these things that he said to you that encourage you to break up a daira buru

or where some of these things said during these phone calls he was making to you.

Yes, just encouraging me to never settle for mediocrity is was really what it centered on relationships, careers, anything.

Also when he found out Darryl's age he was making fun of him.

What do you mean making fun of him?

Just that I was dating grandpa, things like that.

Just little jokes and I didn't really find it funny but I didn't get overly offended or anything.

I just said he's not like that.

I described him as handsome and like that.

What at this point in time was it about Mr.

Alexander encouraged you or help maybe push you over the edge so to speak to break up with Darryl.

Like I said,

some of the things he said helped me to gain a different perspective and step back and take a look at my life and I realized things weren't going anywhere.

If probably weren't for Travis, I have just continued on like that until they're all moved and who knows.

with Travis that weekend and I didn't want to I've always been faithful in my

relationships and I didn't want to change that now so I decided to

break things off with Daryl so that I was just free to hang out with Travis without

you know feeling guilty that I was sitting next to him or I fit led to kissing

or something like that Wouldn't it wouldn't be something that I would feel bad about It's time ladies and gentlemen,

please be back in the jury room by 330 you'll start promptly at that time Please remember the admonition You are excused.

Please be seated.

The record will show the presence of the jury, the defendant, and all counsel.

Mr.

Mary, you may continue.

Thank you, Your Honor.

Before the break,

we were talking about this weekend we were spending with Travis and his friends Chris and Scott Hughes and specifically we're talking about

did the time you kissed Mr.

Alexander that was, do my understanding that was in the room that you were in at the Hughes Hall, is that right?

Yes, the bedroom that I was assigned, okay.

Tell us.

You mentioned him coming over, but just kind of described for us, him coming to your room, just of described for us what happened.

Did he knock on the door?

Did he walk in?

Just kind of walk us through.

before going to bed he said I'll come in there in a little bit after they go

after they shut their door and go into their bedroom and go to sleep I guess

I don't know well he wanted to wait until they were in their bedroom so I left the

door cracked because I figured we were just gonna we're having difficulty

hearing you oh sorry I'll try to speak up he came into my room And we started kissing,

we sat down on the bed and started kissing.

Was there a conversation first or did you just come in and start kissing me?

There was no conversation.

I thought there was going to be, but there was no conversation.

Sustained.

Did you anticipate that his sole purpose of coming in the room was to kiss you?

Not his sole purpose, but I had a pretty good idea that it might lead to that.

The word kiss or kissing could be taken up a whole bunch of different ways,

could relate to a simple peck on the cheek to something much more intimate.

Could you describe for us the way that he was kissing?

Yeah, it was more passionate.

It wasn't just regular kissing.

It was passionate, like French kissing.

Okay.

Was he touching you?

Yeah, we were.

I don't really recall the specifics, but we were getting intimate.

We were making out, basically.

And what do you mean by?

intimate.

That also mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people.

So describe for us what you mean by you're getting intimate.

Well at that point we were laying on the bed and we were side-by-side facing each other kissing.

That's what I mean by intimate at that point.

Was he touching any particular parts of your body or were you just kissing?

I don't really recall that at first.

It began to lead to more.

And what do you mean by more?

Um, well, I don't really recall how it happened, but he began to remove my clothes.

And do you recall what you were wearing when he began to remove your clothes?

I was in the jamas of some kind, I sweats and a t-shirt.

Okay.

And this, him taking off your clothes, was that something you were expecting to take place?

No, I thought we were gonna

kiss and maybe heavily, but that that would be the extent of it since this was the first time we were kissing.

When he, began to remove your clothing, was that unsurprising to you?

It was, well yeah, it was a surprising, but it was more, I felt apprehensive, but I was going with it.

What do you mean you felt apprehensive?

Well, I wasn't expecting that, so I didn't want to tell him no, so I just kept going with it.

Why don't you want to tell him no?

I didn't want to do,

I didn't want to do anything that would maybe displease him,

not because I feared that he would get angry or anything,

but I didn't want him to feel rejected and I didn't want him to get his feelings hurt or I didn't want to spoil the mood,

sort of like that.

We were getting long,

we were, we had some kind of chemistry, I just didn't want to like snuff it out right then by saying stop, I guess.

That was my thought.

Why would rejecting him at that point in time be such a big deal to you?

at that point in time, I was not really accustomed to saying no.

I wasn't, I wasn't, I have a lot more backbone now than I used to.

It was hard for me to tell somebody no.

So, even though it was uncomfortable, I just kept going with it.

So, the discomfort you are feeling and going.

Having your clothes removed was less burdensome to you than the discomfort you would feel saying no.

Is that what we're hearing?

I can't really say one way or another because I wouldn't know because I couldn't make the comparison but at the time it felt more uncomfortable to push him off of me or something.

I he wasn't aggressive but he was...

definitely doing the initiating at that point and I just kept going for it.

Did he on this occasion wind up removing your clothes?

Yes.

All your clothes?

Yes.

At this point in time was Mr.

Alexander Yes.

Did that change?

Not really, I think he kept his garments on that he was wearing.

And you say garments, what are you referring to?

I know garments are,

they're called temple garments and they are,

it's like a, it's like a t-shirt and underwear, sort of kind of like briefs, they're sort of an off-white color.

Is that what he came in wearing or just those or was he wearing other things?

No, he had, he had his temple garments on.

I don't remember if he had just the shirt, but I think he was wearing pajamas over those.

And whatever else he was wearing over his garments, did he take those items off or did you?

I don't recall.

I know I didn't.

It might have been a joint effort, but I didn't solely remove them or anything like that.

I really remember.

So after you are undressed and Mr.

Alexander in his undergarment.

What happened?

This is embarrassing.

Is it embarrassing for you to talk about this?

Overreeled.

I understand how it might be, but it's important.

To share this with us.

So if you could, please tell us what happened next.

Um, we began to perform for all sex on me.

And was this comfortable?

You mentioned earlier that you had a certain level of discomfort with this act, the being named.

Were you uncomfortable while this oral sex was going on?

I was uncomfortable,

it was dark,

the were off,

so that might have made it a little bit more tolerable,

but it was,

I don't know,

he knew what he was doing for sure,

but it was just, it felt like too much too soon and, I mean, I couldn't exactly rewind at that point, you know?

Why not?

Did you voice your displeasure with the events?

No, I can't say that it was displeasure, but it was uncomfortable.

Okay, well, let me rephrase my question.

Then did voice your discomfort.

to him?

No.

I didn't want to give him that impression.

Why not?

Why not, Mr.

Harris?

Why not?

Why didn't you voice your discomfort?

I didn't want him to have that impression.

I wanted to, I wanted to at least appear like I was enjoying it as it's easy to be.

So you were attempting to give him the impression that you were enjoying things?

Yes.

And why were you interested in doing that?

I guess it would have seemed to me to be unattractive for me to say anything different or anything negative about the experience.

Okay.

What happened after he performed oral sex upon you?

He asked for reciprocation.

And how did that request make you feel?

At that point,

if I had taken it that far, I was kind of glad he was done and I was just willing to reciprocate at that point.

And so we're clear when you say reciprocate, does that mean perform oral sex upon him?

Yes.

And did he remove his garments at that time or how did that occur?

I don't know if his, the garments at the bottom came all the way off or just pushed down.

The shirt remained on and yeah.

And yeah what?

I don't remember what happened.

I think they obviously came down.

I don't know if they came all the way off or not.

I can't remember.

Did he perform, or excuse me, did you perform oral sex upon him at that time?

Yes.

Did he ejaculate?

Yes.

Where?

In my mouth.

What happened after he ejected?

I think we fell asleep,

I don't recall getting dressed again, I don't even recall getting with blankets, but when I woke up we were both covered with blankets.

Okay, you were both in the same bedroom on your bed.

Yes.

And were you dressed?

When I woke up not initially, but I put my pajamas back on.

I don't remember what time I woke up, but was before everyone else did.

I remember falling asleep.

I think he might have woken up because I woke up and he got dressed and left the room.

And from what you told us earlier.

This occurred,

this incident occurred Saturday night and the next morning would have been Sunday morning the day you were to go to church, is that correct?

Yes.

What happened from that point in time on?

Do you mean that morning?

Yes.

When he, you were telling us how he eventually left you, got dressed and left your bedroom, what happened from that point?

Um, basically rest of the house will begin to wake up.

I hadn't been to church since I was about 11, so I didn't really have church clothes.

I about two dresses before heading out there.

I asked Sky which one would be more appropriate,

so then I put on an outfit and the rest of the household was getting ready for church,

and then we took separate cars, I took my car, I Travis wrote with me on that one over, and...

would they maybe it was Jeff and the Hughes is to their own vehicle and what

was the service like was there a particular subject matter the service that day I don't recall exactly what was said,

but I do remember that one of the speakers was Sky's brother,

Zion, who had just gotten back from his mission, so he was giving a talk related to maybe something related, I don't remember the topic.

Something related to what?

But it would have been related to his topic,

but because when you speak in church, you're given a topic to talk about, and I don't recall what the subject matter was.

But he was speaking from the podium.

After, prior to going to church, did you and Mr.

Alexander a this incident the night before.

No.

Did you speak about the incident that day after church?

No.

After, what happened after the church services?

We had the church service and I drove back,

well I drove back in my car, Travis Road Shotgun, Jeff was behind me and Sky was behind Travis.

We were driving back and she found,

in the back of my seat she found a portfolio of my photography and she was flipping through it and there was a photograph of Darryl in

that photo that I had taken a headshot of him kind of growling at the camera.

and it in black and white,

it really cool and she showed it to Travis,

so that was the first time Travis saw Daryl, so that was, I don't know, I kind of lost track of the question, I'm sorry.

Okay, did you, before you left?

I assume for much you're telling us before that you left the Jesus home on Sunday that Sunday is that correct?

Yes, I did before leaving and by leaving the use of home you're going to return to Palm Desert.

Were you ever alone with Mr.

Alexander to you leaving the home from the time you went to church to the time you left the home with the two of you ever

alone together?

Not that I recall everyone was home.

So you didn't have a chance to speak about this incident within that is that correct?

I may have had an opportunity if I'd wanted to pull inside but it was not discussed.

After you well when you left the home Travis part ways were you expecting to call each other or what was there?

He walked me out to my car and kissed me and I got in the car and drove off Back to Palm desert Yeah,

I stopped and got gas and I think I went to Starbucks and then I went back to Palm Desert.

Alright.

When did you next hear from Mr.

Alexander?

I would say it would ever have been that night or Monday night.

And how did you, what, how, what was the means that you conducted or, or contacted Mr.

Alexander, did call you?

Was in person?

We were calling each other back and forth at that point, so don't remember who called him, but it was over the phone.

When you spoke was their conversation related to this incident that that evening There may have been some reference to it,

but we mostly talked about church and you wanted to know how I liked it At this point in

time When you return from palm desert you've been to church

Have any religious officials from the Mormon Church contacted you at this point in time.

No, not yet.

When did that occur?

Well Travis gave me a book of Mormon on Wednesday and I think around that same time he contacted

the church and I don't know how it works but he gave him my information so that some missionaries

in that area could come to my house.

You mentioned Travis gave you a book of Mormon on Wednesday.

Was this the Wednesday following the Sunday that you left the Jesus?

Yes.

Okay.

And where did you see Mr.

Alexander on Wednesday?

He was leaving Riverside and driving back to Mesa and Palm Desert is on that stretch, that's on the I-10.

And he called me on the way and wanted to meet with me so that he could give me a copy

of the Book of Mormon and I agreed to meet with him.

I didn't really know where he could meet though because Darryl was home and I didn't want to bring some guy over.

So where did you want that meeting?

We ended up meeting at a Starbucks which was near my house.

And is this where he gave you the Book of Mormon?

Yes.

Did you have a conversation at this Starbucks?

Yes.

And what was that?

subject matter of this conversation.

He didn't give me the book of Mormon right away.

He had Napoleon with him which risked his dog.

He's a black bug on the leash, and we, I don't remember where an appointment was, but we went inside the store to get dressed.

You're in the Starbucks, he has his dog with him, what is the, what is the subject matter of conversation inside the Starbucks?

the word of wisdom but we were sitting outside in the shade.

It a little hot but it was still somewhat it was cooler in the shade.

Okay so you were at the Starbucks just sitting outside you were talking about the word of wisdom right?

Yes.

Okay and for those of us who are not familiar what is the to your understanding at that point in time,

what is the word of wisdom?

The word of wisdom is LDS doctrine that states, it prohibits the consumption of coffee, tea, alcohol, tobacco, and drugs.

Do those same words relate to the vow of chastity or is that something completely different?

The law of chastity is different from the word of wisdom.

There are two separate commandments.

After the two of you were at Starbucks, outside, What happens next?

Well, we discussed the word it was a little more because he was drinking Chai tea, Chai-S-T.

He said that doesn't count, and I asked him why I explained his reasons.

I was drinking a latte, an isolate, and so as our conversation progressed, into a box.

I don't know how to explain it but basically he expressed that he was horny is what he said.

And once he made this expression Did you remain at the Starbucks or did you go elsewhere?

Well, he said I wish I was somewhere you can go and I said, I'm sorry, sustained.

We both were trying to figure out a place where we could go.

I don't know why, but I was wanting to go with him also to find someplace.

So went in our respective cars and drove to a park near Starbucks.

It between my house and Starbucks.

And it was the middle of a school day, so nobody was there.

There was a parking lot there, and we pulled up into the parking lot.

And...

Napoleon in the car with the air conditioner on and the windows rolled up and he came into my car and sat in the passenger seat.

And after he sat in the passenger seat You mentioned that he expressed that he was, to use your words, horny, right?

Yes.

What was the point of him getting in your car at the park?

To your understanding?

I didn't know it's at first.

I my car was very...

She didn't know it was cars.

She has the port.

I did not know the point of it.

Okay.

I mean I didn't know what he was expecting.

I know the I apologize.

When he got in the car...

Did he voice or convey an interest in engaging in some sort of sexual activity with you in the car?

Yes.

What sort of activity to your understanding was he interested in?

And so we're clear, was that oral sex that you were to be performing on him or him performing on you?

He wanted to receive it.

Did you comply?

Yes.

Why?

I felt...

I felt an attraction to him.

And the feeling was mutual and I wanted to, I just wanted to, I don't know, I to do what he wanted to do.

Yes.

Okay.

Why?

I think I liked him.

Prior to,

in between the first incident and the home of Chris and Stuy Hughes,

where oral sex took place, and the time that you were in the park, you had conversed with Mr.

Alexander a few times.

Yes.

During those conversations, did you ever voice it?

You're discomfort about what happened that Saturday night in the Hughes home.

No, I didn't.

Did oral sex take place in your car?

Yes.

Did he ejaculate?

Yes.

Where?

I don't remember actually after he ejaculated what happened from that point on.

He fixed the visor mirror and pulled his pants back up.

What do you mean he fixed the visor mirror?

He had it flipped.

Well, when I started he flipped the visor down and angled the mirror.

I guess it's good.

When you started what?

Toral sex.

What happened then when after he fixed the mirror, did you guys hang out for a longer go to the park?

What you do?

No.

I guess I was under the impression that we were...

I was actually not responsible for what you do.

What did you do?

What happened?

We parted ways.

What's that?

We parted ways.

Immediately.

Yes.

How did you feel after that encounter?

I don't recall feeling really bad, maybe just a little deflated.

He refused to kiss me afterward because he said it was gross.

I maybe not sick as I was just performing oral sex, but that's what he said.

And so he kissed me on the cheek and left.

And I know this might be hard for you, but I kind of want you to address my question.

How did you feel?

afterwards.

I'm going to answer a proper question as to how Kelsey could possibly know how she feels.

Appreciate it, please.

After Mr.

Alexander departed.

How did you feel about the fact that you would just perform oral sex equipment?

I felt a little disappointed with myself, but it's hard to describe.

Like was attracted to him, he was attracted to me.

He obviously derived a lot of pleasure from that so that I took as a good sign.

But again, I was just...

bit too much too soon.

I not that, I mean I've been intimate before but not that quickly.

So you were disappointed in yourself being that intimate.

that early on in your relationship?

Yeah, it wasn't so much the intimacy, but the rapidness, the timing, I guess you could say.

And I've been with Darrel four and a half years, so was the only person I've known for that time.

So this was, But it was, but it wasn't, if that makes sense.

Okay.

To clarify too, at this point in time, this encounter in the park, were you in love with Mr.

Alexander?

No.

And he departed, what did you do?

I drove home and got ready for work.

He left me a voicemail.

Okay.

On your cell phone or on a home phone?

On my cell phone.

Okay.

And what was the subject matter of that voicemail?

Um, he was expressing his thoughts.

I'm not sure how to answer that question.

The incident, I guess, would be the subject matter.

When you're talking about the subject matter was the oral sex it just took place.

Yes, I would.

Yes or no?

Yes.

I guess.

And if you can characterize it, was he expressing happiness, gratitude about the event?

I wouldn't characterize it that way.

How would you characterize it?

I'm not sure how.

How would you characterize it?

I would say that he was, I'm trying to think how to characterize it without saying what he said.

Well, let me ask you this.

What he did, he voiced displeasure with what took place.

He voiced displeasure with himself.

Okay.

was that related to the fact that this incident took place of how he you?

Both.

OK.

This was you received this voice mail before you went to work that that day, right?

I think I received it while I was working Do you recall were you working

An evening shift or do you recall what hours you were working?

I was working afternoon evening And at this point in time time,

you were living a home in the Palm Desert home by yourself, is that right?

Darrell was still there, we were in separate bedrooms at all times at that point.

Were you still, were you and Darryl at a place where you were friends friendly or was it a caustic environment?

It was not caustic.

It was friendly, just no longer intimate.

Okay.

Did you wind up speaking, when was the next time after this incident in the car?

that you wound up speaking to Mr.

Alexander.

It would have either been that night or the fall or night.

You mentioned a voicemail where he was Somewhat,

I guess apologetic for how he treated you and what took place Did you ever

Just testify that that's exactly what he's expressed And it's your question Were you given the opportunity to,

or I should say this way,

did you ever take advantage of the opportunity to express your displeasure or discomfort with what had been taking place sexually in your relationship?

Yes.

Someone.

What do you mean by someone?

I sent him a response in response to his postman.

I sent him an email.

After this encounter in the car, Are you still speaking with Mr.

Alexander?

How frequently are you speaking to Mr.

Alexander?

Almost every night.

And are these quick conversations or these extensive conversations?

These are long conversations.

hours are some of these are these conversations I understand that each one

is probably somewhat unique but were they spiritual in nature yes they were

spiritual were they sexual in nature yes flirty okay flirty yes okay and when was the next time and mr.

Alexander to your understanding was still living in Mesa right yes When was the next point in time that you saw Mr.

Alexander?

It would have been in October?

October of...

2006, okay.

When did this meeting take place?

I don't remember the exact date.

There are photos with the dates.

Well, let me ask you this.

Where did this meeting take place?

This, we met up in Erenburg.

I think it's in California, technically.

Okay.

It's right on the border.

I'm sorry, what was that?

It's right on the border of California and Arizona.

Okay.

And much later was this meeting,

was this weeks later, days later when you met in Erenburg from the incident in the park in your car?

I would say it was about a month later,

okay, so you didn't physically see him for about a month but you spoke every day on the phone?

Yes, almost every day.

And as a result of those conversations,

well let me ask you this,

because we talked about some Mormon officials coming to your home, Did that begin after this incident of oral sex in the park?

Yes.

What was that also before?

you went to Erenburg.

Yes.

What were these, I say Mormon officials, but what we would call missionaries?

Yes.

How often would these missionaries come to your home?

I think they came on average two times a week.

And what went on when they came to your home?

The first time they came, I think they had made an appointment.

They invited me to church every week.

They have a system in the Mormon church when you're introducing somebody to the church for the first time.

They're called discussions and there are There's a discussion you take first and then second third and on,

which sort of introduces you to the church, how it was founded, truths that they believe in.

Okay.

Let me ask you as part of this.

These meetings in this process, those meetings you were having with the missionaries, and I brought up earlier the vow of chastity.

Did they speak to you about that?

No.

Not that I really thought.

When did you learn at the ballot chastity to your recollection?

I think actually prior to my baptism, those things were briefly explained to me, they're young men, so they really get into detail.

So from your perspective, this described, since you've been there, described for us Aaron Berg.

Is this a big town?

Was there a particular reason why you were going there?

What was the point of meeting in Aaron Berg?

Yes, the point was so we could spend time together and it was a halfway point so he didn't have to drive all the

way to California because he hadn't planned to come out to California until

the following month and I'd never been to Arizona so I wasn't even thinking of going to Arizona but Aaron Berg was about halfway.

And what was the plan, what were you, from your impression, what were you going to do in Ehrenberg?

We were going to hang out and we talked extensively over the month,

so I thought there would be more conversation, probably some intimacy that was hinted at heavily so that was expected.

What do you mean the intimacy was heavily hinted at?

What time you, what he said, did he express the desire to be?

be intimate with you again.

Yes.

I'm a little confused because it seemed like you would talk to us before about after this incident in the park how Mr.

Alexander expressed some misgivings about what happened.

Did he express those misgivings before meeting you in Ehrenberg?

No, after that, she just has a question.

She hasn't even got a word ahead of her mouth.

No.

Ask another question.

You were going to Ehrenberg with the idea that, at least partially, that some intimate encounters might take place.

Yes.

Okay.

And Alexander expressed any mistake.

those encounters occurring.

No, that kind of the purpose of the trip.

OK.

And by intimate encounters, what, to your understanding, were you expecting, at least from the sexually speaking.

Maybe more of the same as before, but nothing further than that.

That's kind of pretty far, but nothing beyond that.

Okay, so at this point in time, based on what you told us, it's our understanding that you had not.

penile vaginal intercourse with Mr.

Alexander, is that correct?

And it would also be understanding that you had not had anal sexual intercourse with Alexander, is that correct?

Yes, that's correct.

Tell us about Aaron Burke, did you?

Share one hotel room is each have your own room.

We had one hotel room hotel room.

Okay, and When did you arrive in Erenburg?

I Got there later than him because I had to work and so I arrived late at night Okay,

was this Friday night, was this Saturday night?

I think it was either Thursday or Friday night.

I don't remember my exact schedule.

Well, let ask you this.

How many nights were you to spend in Erenburg?

Two.

Tell us what happened when you arrived.

When I arrived, he...

Well, when I arrived, he came to the door and let me in and then brought me over to bed and we just started kissing.

I assume then that he was already in the room.

Yes, he got the room.

Okay.

He said you started kissing.

Was there a conversation first or did it immediately lead to kissing?

No, we had some conversation over the phone on the way there.

So when I arrived, it was physical right away.

And we talked earlier, I mentioned earlier how kissing could mean different things.

Could be the friendly to the passionate.

What sort of kissing was this?

Passionate.

Was he attempting to remove your clothing?

At this point in time was this level of intimacy something you felt comfortable with.

At this point,

I was a little more comfortable with it because we had been talking for a time and I felt like I knew him better.

And also, I don't think I was as nervous because it wasn't the first time that we were like that.

In your mind, was this supposed to be a romantic weekend, if you will?

Yes.

did it turn out to be that not too much romance it wasn't everything I was

expecting but I didn't have high expectations but we didn't connect really like we did on the phone All right,

ladies and gentlemen, tomorrow morning, 10.30 a.m.

Please remember the admonition.

For your planning purposes, we will not have court this Thursday.

We will be here tomorrow Wednesday, but no court on Thursday.

Have a nice evening.

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Özet Dışa Aktar Sözlü Pratik

Daha Fazla Özelliği Açın

Trancy uzantısını yükleyerek, AI altyazılar, AI kelime tanımları, AI dilbilgisi analizi, AI konuşma vb. dahil olmak üzere daha fazla özelliği açabilirsiniz.

Büyük Video Platformlarıyla Uyumlu

Trancy, YouTube, Netflix, Udemy, Disney+, TED, edX, Kehan, Coursera gibi platformlar için çift dilli altyazı desteği sağlamakla kalmaz, aynı zamanda düzenli web sayfaları için AI kelime/cümle çevirisi, tam metin etkileşimli çeviri ve diğer özellikler sunar. Gerçek bir çok yönlü dil öğrenme asistanıdır.

Tüm Platform Tarayıcıları

Trancy, iOS Safari tarayıcı uzantısı dahil olmak üzere tüm platform tarayıcılarını destekler.

Çoklu Görüntüleme Modları

Tiyatro, okuma, karışık ve diğer görüntüleme modlarını destekleyerek kapsamlı bir çift dilli deneyim sunar.

Çoklu Uygulama Modları

Cümle dikte, sözlü değerlendirme, çoktan seçmeli, dikte ve diğer uygulama modlarını destekler.

AI Video Özeti

Videoları özetlemek ve hızlı bir şekilde temel içeriği kavramak için OpenAI kullanın.

AI Altyazılar

Sadece 3-5 dakikada doğru ve hızlı YouTube AI altyazıları oluşturun.

AI Kelime Tanımları

Altyazılardaki kelimelere dokunarak, AI destekli tanımlarıyla kelime anlamlarını öğrenin.

AI Dilbilgisi Analizi

Cümle dilbilgisini analiz ederek cümle anlamlarını hızlıca anlayın ve zor dilbilgisi konularını öğrenin.

Daha Fazla Web Özelliği

Çift dilli video altyazılarının yanı sıra, Trancy ayrıca web sayfaları için kelime çevirisi ve tam metin çevirisi sağlar.